I knew a man who died in the 70's because WT said "No organ transplants".... He needed a kidney. He got hours and hours of dialysis before he finally died.
Not long after, WT decided it was "ok" to get transplants.
cha ching
JoinedPosts by cha ching
-
6
EU top court rules on JW blood transfusion case
by Corney inthe court of justice of the european union (cjeu) yesterday delivered the judgment (press release) on a request of the supreme court of latvia on whether domestic authorities are obliged to reimburse costs of cross-border medical treatment when the patient's decision to perform it in another european country was based on religious, not medical, grounds.
the opinion of advocate general (summarized here) is helpful in understanding the case.. the son of the applicant in the main proceedings had to have open heart surgery.
that operation was available in the latter’s member state of affiliation, latvia, but could not be carried out without a blood transfusion.
-
-
-
44
Three new lawsuits against Watchtower filed under NY Child Victims Act (CVA) this October, bringing number of CVA cases up to six
by Corney innew cases:.
diaz case, filed on 10/21/2020 by zalkin law firm - two plaintiffs abused (here and hereinafter - allegedly) by two ministerial servants in 1970s.. iglesias case, filed on 10/19/2020 by eisenberg & baum, llp against various nyc and wt entities - abused by an "elder john doe" and "[travelling] overseer john" in 1970s and 1980s.. aldridge case, filed 10/06/2020 by zalkin law firm - abused by a congregation elder in 1970s.. older cases:.
tarry case (no 1 and no 2), filed on 09/17/2019 and 07/23/2020 by parker waichman llp - abused by a publisher in 1984. very weak case.
-
-
cha ching
"Don't worry, wait on Jehovah, He will take care of it in time"...
The famous response to anything they cannot find a logical reason for.
If an imperfect human would stop this abuse right away, why would a loving powerful god let this terribly criminal act keep hurting children?
Thank you, Corney, for the updates. It is nice to see that someone cares.
-
22
But you told us about those dates.
by Lost in the fog inyou couldn't make it up!
saw this wt quote on a friend's page.
it is from the awake magazine of 1993, march 22nd apparently.
-
-
cha ching
Liars, liars, liars.... That is what WT is, and they know it.... and they do it, because they have the power.
WT tries to make you crazy, it 'gaslights' you by saying "We never said that, we never promised that, you just don't remember." I lived thru all of it.
They are are cold hearted DFers. As the Canadian WT lawyer lied, "We do not shun".
Thank you ALL for your quotes.
-
38
HELP!! Just Woken Up - Fanatical Mom wants to report me
by Scarlett_Martin ini've just been introduced to this site by a pimo friend of mine.
this will be my first post on this website.
i need help, and he told me you guys are a very supportive community.. i'm a female in my mid twenties.
-
-
cha ching
Hi Scarlett, It is kinda crazy when you first 'wake up.' You might feel you have to all kinds of things fast. I researched, researched, researched. I had to tell people at work what happened to me, etc.
Just know that with time, things settle down. Learn from the experience of others who have left.
Also, I grew up in JWville from the age of 5. I am 65 now, I left in 2011. I was there for the "stay alive till 75" (Star Wars came out in 77ish, and I hoped Armageddon wouldn't come before the next movie, haha)... "you will never grow old in this system" (Wow, here I am... 65) "don't go to college, by the time you finish Armageddon will be here, and you'll never be able to use it" (I was 14, I would have definitely been able to use a college education"
The WT is evil to guilt people into things. It is a cult. High control, that is why all of your feelings of "it's wrong to live with someone I am not married to" comes into your head. Why can't you? The Bible? Who says the Bible is right? Research how the 'Bible' was discovered. They found all kinds of 'books' in that cave. Not all of the 'books/scrolls' were included in the final Bible, and who decided? Catholic monks? Wow! and JW's accept that. Why would the Bible have to be hidden away for so many years? Why couldn't God just make it appear? He is, after all, sooooo powerful.
Our brains were trained in so many ways to 'just accept' what we heard, right? "Jehovah's people are the smartest people on earth", clap, clap, clap... I remember, at the end, thinking it so weird to hear people clap at conventions at the stupidest little remarks. In 2010(?) the remark was made about Harold Camping, how he predicted (a few times, in our day) how he figured out when Armageddon would come. The last one being, can't remember exactly, but close to 2010. "How dumb is that? The Bible says "no one knows the date or the hour", everyone laughed, and laughed and clapped. Then he goes onto explain about overlapping generations... Weird, huh?
Meeting with elders... think about it, don't fear it, but.... I once met with "the elders" in a room of 10. I had been seeking help from friends, and the elders thought I shouldn't be telling everyone my life. I got yelled at, could not escape (a Sunday meeting was going on in the outside room) cried so loud, a knock at the door and the Spanish brothers were asking "can you keep it down?", I couldn't.... but didn't want anyone to see who was crying, so I was stuck. The 'elder in charge'... a guy who drove a garbage truck, yelled "Look at me" Look at me! " I got PTSD, and nightmares of that for over a year. Nowadays, I could handle it... but back then, I was surprised and very vulnerable. If you can't handle being spoken to in a mean or controlling way, or your nerves can't handle it, don't do it. You have no obligation to talk to MEN... they are JUST men, remember that.... they aren't psychologists, mentors, trained to help, they are ordinary people that the WT uses to control the masses. Really.
Also, after time, this all just seems like a bad dream. Be glad you are in your twenties. You have a great future ahead of you. Even me, tho 65, I am sooooooooo glad to live like this: free. I don't need to feel guilty about what I watch on TV, read on the internet, dance like, go to a concert, etc. I can do anything I like. I am not a bad person, I am a free person. Guilt is the blood that the WT vampire needs to suck out of you to control you.
Picture another cult... Amish? where you have to wear certain clothes, can't use modern machines, etc. You have no problem seeing the control there, right? View the WT just like that, and it will help broaden your ability to escape.
Go live with your friend if you want, don't if you don't want to. It's up to you. Or,live with him and don't have sex. Options, options, options. You have them all.
Your mom..... Unfortunately, nowadays, the WT has tightened it's grip and cinched up the knot that ties people in ever more. I feel like people's brains are even smaller, and they are more inclined to "love their rules" even more. Rules make people feel righteous, important. It might be like living in the days of "kill the witches, she's a witch, she's a witch". Yikes.
My mom is a JW in her 80's. She needed me (an 'out exJW) to help her clean up her yard and house so the city would not kick her & my dad (a non JW who was a hoarder, and had alzheimer's -tho at the time, we didn't know) for over a year, every weekend!
She was nice, spoke to me, spoke to my husband who WAS DF'd for testifying at a child sex abuse case, and my sister who had left (never baptized) but when the job was done, that was IT! She didn't need me or my sister or my husband. When I came to visit my dad, she opened the door and said, "You know the rules, You know the rules". (which meant she couldn't talk to me) I told her I wasn't there to see her, but visit dad, and she let me in. Then Covid came in March of this year, I couldn't visit (lockdown) but my JW sister could (to 'help') and by May, I got a call from my DF'd niece in Scotland, 'My dad (an elder) said grandpa is really sick, not doing well, you should see him soon". My sister & I went the day after, he looked like a pile of bones, and he couldn't talk. I told him we were there to say we love him, and want to say good bye, an 30 seconds later, he let out his last breath.
My mom didn't tell me. My sisters didn't tell me... my DF'd niece did. Then, did they ask if I wanted any of dad's things? nope, they were giving them to 'the congregation'. OMG!
So, moral of the story? Don't count on any JW for anything. They have been trained. I have talked to so many Ex-JW's.... the same thing... Things have really tightened up.
Your mom MIGHT be different, but don't count on it. Be prepared.
Life outside of the organization is GREAT!!! You have your own mind! Your time can be spent as YOU wish, no more "treadmill, hamster wheel" time for the WT! YAY! No more studying, repeating, brainwashing! YAY! You will LOOOOOVVVVEEE it!
You are FFFRRRREEEEEEEEEEE!
Enjoy!
-
46
The Society and 1975.
by Lost in the fog instumbled upon this article - not that the wt society ever highlighted the date of 1975, but that was brothers running ahead... .
w68 8/15 pp.
494-501. https://wol.jw.org/en/wol/d/r1/lp-e/1968602#h=1:0 .
-
-
cha ching
Data Dog, I looked up that article (I have original, paper WTs) and they DIDN'T change the wording, regarding their chronology, "but admittably not infallible", which goes to prove they always give themselves a way out, and KNEW it was wrong from the beginning.
I tried to post a picture of it, but it wouldn't upload 😔
-
13
Call Me MacGyver!
by Terry ini rode my bicycle to the corner gas station / convenience store.i couldn't find my regular mask - so - i improvised.as i walked up to the young lady clerk, her eyes grewwide wide wider and she said:"that's a um very unique face mask you have there, sir.
"i grinned invisibly.
"yep, i actually made it from an old pair of purple boxer shorts.
-
-
cha ching
Dang! Just when i was thinking i was so inventive! We are having so much fun with masks! And we haven't even drank any bleach!
-
84
Do you have any evidence that the GB had bad intent?
by AlainAlam indo you have any evidence that the gb had bad intent?
as opposed to blind faith/cognitive dissonance and honest mistakes.. i'm inclined to think they have the best of intentions and are just wrong (primarily because the bible is wrong), but i'm willing to consider the evidence otherwise..
-
-
cha ching
Thanks Jeff, nice to hear from someone who was there.
Yep, it doesn't actually matter... if they do or don't, kinda...but it pmo (pisses me off) that they do! Grrrrrr...
I would have left either way, but I guess I just wanted to peek behind that curtain & have myself some well deserved dose of reality, long denied.
:-)
-
28
Should You Be Required To Wear A Coronavirus Mask?
by minimus insome towns require everyone going outside to wear one.
one massachusetts city requires anyone from 5 up to wear a mask.
some cities require masks and have shut down parks and sports playing while others in a nearby town have no such restrictions.
-
-
cha ching
OMG MeanMr Mustard! that is Hilaaaaarious! Thx for the laugh!
-
84
Do you have any evidence that the GB had bad intent?
by AlainAlam indo you have any evidence that the gb had bad intent?
as opposed to blind faith/cognitive dissonance and honest mistakes.. i'm inclined to think they have the best of intentions and are just wrong (primarily because the bible is wrong), but i'm willing to consider the evidence otherwise..
-
-
cha ching
The BEST part about it is.... WT has written it... WT admits it....
No need to debate anything else about 607, such as
*When did the 70 weeks of years begin? Nope, we have the tablets.
* Should we use the 360 or 365 days in a year to figure the 2,520 years? Hey, you've got the tablets.
*No need to debate the "day for a year" because Jerusalem was destroyed in 587. The WT admits.
*Was the "7 times" talking about Nebuchadnezzar or a future date?
No need to debate, no need to consider. That's what the WT takes it's pride in doing.... Distraction, distraction, distraction. It loves debates because they bend the brain. Nope.... 587 is the date.... admitted by WT, confirmed by actual data from that time period.
Simple... and WT hates simple.
-
84
Do you have any evidence that the GB had bad intent?
by AlainAlam indo you have any evidence that the gb had bad intent?
as opposed to blind faith/cognitive dissonance and honest mistakes.. i'm inclined to think they have the best of intentions and are just wrong (primarily because the bible is wrong), but i'm willing to consider the evidence otherwise..
-
-
cha ching
Dear AA & NewLight,
When I first left, oddly enough, even though I knew it wasn't 'the truth' (607 was false, and that meant 1914 was false, and that meant the GB were not "chosen" when they said they were) I still had this desire to find out "Do the GB know what they are doing?" I too wanted to know if they were "evil", and to me that meant misleading me for their own gain.
It may be because of our upbringing... never wanting to accuse anyone falsely. Right?
We were always taught to "tell the truth" "don't be a liar like Satan, the ruler of this world" so much so, that I couldn't lie about anything, and wondered "How can the WT say that brothers under persecution/ banned from preaching (like Germany, Russia in the 40's) can deceive/lie about whether they were hiding literature when crossing the border, then have the WT brag about it as if "Jehovah was protecting them".... Yay, bros, lie some more. Oh yeah, "theocratic warfare".... that was their caveat. Still, I wanted "to be fair" and "give the GB a chance."
So, I investigated.... I am glad to see that you are both doing so. The farther you go down the rabbit hole, the more you will see, the more you will realize that the 'organization' is not so pure and innocent.
20/20 is a "Dateline" show in the United States, which had Barbara Anderson in it. She worked in WT headquarters writing & researching articles. It was a major breakthrough in the revealing of how WT hides child sex abuse. Here is a link: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fJq1XtJNzA8
How do I know 607 is a lie? The two WT's of 2011 (which I anxiously awaited... I had called headquarters and asked them about this "overlapping generation" I had heard about at the convention, and the 'brother' there said "our brothers work so hard, they are going to print some articles".... So, me? I wanted to be fair, give them a chance... even tho I was upset. I had been told, since I was a child (born in the 50's) that 'I should not go to college, pursue higher education because by the time I had completed it, Armageddon would be here, and my time would be wasted away.' I was told I should save peoples lives, not be selfish and seek my own wealth or health or future.
So, when the two articles came out, I examined them in detail. I was amazed that they included references. Real references. Book titles, page numbers, authors, EVERY thing. Usually, the WT does NOT give you the details, just vague references, right?
I studied them, cut them up, highlighted them just as on a police investigation board. You've seen them, right? lines connecting clues? The WT has the habit of starting a subject in a paragraph, then saying "we'll discuss that later", then uses all kinds of distractions, illustrations, and by the time you are done you forgot what they were going to prove in more detail.
In the article they had a quote about the actual business tablets found in Babylon. Made by people who lived during the 70 years of Babylon's rule. These people were meticulous record keepers. Businessmen. They would keep track of their daily earnings/ sellings. They recorded the names of the kings, what year of their reign and something astronomical (where Venus was? the Moon? can't remember) Sooo.... There are real actual records, Why do they talk about a 'rock' with inscriptions 200 years later with a crack in it? they say, 'we can't see where it's cracked, what it says, what it means.... but it coulllllllld say this, it coulllllld say that' ...
I found my quote from the magazine I posted 5 months ago. The WT admits, if you go by these tablets, 587 is when it fell. No need for discussion. No need for other rocks. They know it was 587, they need 607. Number shuffelling...
How did this help me see that they know what they are doing? In one of those red books from the early 1900's I read how they knew the 'Finished Mystery' (the old one) was inspired. They counted the steps from one factory (where it was written or started) to the other factory, where it was printed, and related it to a weird scripture (ezekiel? or a small book near there) that had 1,246 in it (or some crazy number)
Here is their conclusion: If you count the steps from here to there and you minus the steps from when the roadway/ train was moved.... you get 1, 246!!! That proves it is from Godd!
This is not an exact quote... it's 3 a.m., so I am not getting up to find it... but you get the point.
I cried. When I saw how easy it was for them to shuffle numbers in the Finished Mystery, I realized that is what they continually do. When Eve was created (how many years from Adam) kept changing, 1914 was suppose to be Armageddon, then became the great tribulation, then more and more dates in the early 1900's were updated, said to have significance "the end" "tribulation" etc, etc, 1975, "none of these people will die before Armageddon" we are promised....
It is too sad. They do know it. They are numerologists, magicians who hide their true identity. Do the research, do the math.
Here is a post I made about 4 months ago about 607.
What DO WT publications say? (in very, very tiny print, hoping you don't notice)
In it's infamous Oct & Nov 2011 WT articles page 24 (after explaining on page 23 that business tablets from the Babylonian era "were dated to the day, the month and the year of the reigning king.") column two underneath the 3rd paragraph
"Business tablets exist for all the years traditionally attributed to the Neo-Babylonian kings. When the years that these kings ruled are totalled, and a calculation is made back from the last Neo-Babylonian king, Nabonidus, the date reached for the destruction of Jerusalem is 587 BCE"
Bam!
We don't need to look at cracked stones written 200 years later, ask stupid questions of "what if".... We have documents for alllllll the years during Babylon's reign.